Glasgow-Carlisle V4

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Wed 02 Oct 2013, 7:57 pm

NiallGray wrote:Pics of a short extension to Baillieston  for those who are interested. Link takes you to UKTS.

http://forums.uktrainsim.com/viewtopic.php?f=239&t=122529&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=36

Niall
Oh woe is me, I went and added another station you've probably never heard of, Nitshill. Almost complete, there's a few pics on the link.

http://forums.uktrainsim.com/viewtopic.php?f=239&t=122529&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=43

If anyone's interested it's the station after Priesthill & Darnley.

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Thu 23 Jan 2014, 7:58 pm

Belated update for anyone who does not follow the UKTS thread,







NiallGray wrote:Just to say, I'm back working on a route.

Work is going to be focused on the last station added, Shettleston. While the station was never going to be a problem for me, it was the sidings of the permanent way depot next to it that initially put me off. However, while it's not 100% accurate, it's close enough for my liking and I avoided using any dynamic track. (Important if I ever use the hidewire utility.)


NiallGray wrote:A little bit of work done today on Shettleston, area slowly coming to life.

There's no Tesco in MSTS, so used some retail warehouse shapes to simulate it. Aim is to finish off the station and surrounding area, first and then scenerise along the line.

Hopefully do a little more over the weekend.

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  rufuskins on Thu 23 Jan 2014, 10:56 pm

NiallGray wrote:
There's no Tesco in MSTS, so used some retail warehouse shapes to simulate it.

As they say "Every little helps!"!

Continues to impress.


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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Fri 24 Jan 2014, 5:35 pm

*groan*  Rolling Eyes Wink 

Enforced day of not working, so did some more work on Shettleston. Getting to look how I want it to now.

A test act stopping at all stations on the North Clyde line comes in at around 20-22 minutes, depending on stopping time at Queen Street Low Level. That's not bad in my book, considering originally I was looking at 12-14 minutes max, and I will easily be able to write some acts for it when the time comes. Was well worth adding in the two extra stations.






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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Sun 26 Jan 2014, 9:31 pm



Bar a little bit of tweaking needed by those retail warehouses in the earlier shots, I've completed the gap between Carntyne and Shettleston stations and next time I'm going to work on past the station. Normally I'd end the line just a little bit after the last station but because there's a long good loop (and turnback siding), it goes on another 3/4 mile.

Hoping I can finish that next weekend. Smile

Niall


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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Fri 31 Jan 2014, 4:32 pm

Shettleston extension is done and dusted.








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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  rufuskins on Fri 31 Jan 2014, 6:35 pm

It must have been a real pain trying to dust those rails with all that rain!  Wink   Wink   Wink 

However it still looks a treat!


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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Sat 10 May 2014, 2:48 pm

The Johnstone/Elderslie extension is just about complete. Johnstone needs a little more work as I had to add some track to the route because AI trains were disappearing in sight of the station.


Johnstone (Other side of station is not quite yet complete)






Elderslie










Rickloader's gas holder marked the previous end of the line.


Coming into Paisley.


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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  rufuskins on Sat 10 May 2014, 8:13 pm

Continues to impress, and I hope the earlier travails are now resolved?


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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Sat 10 May 2014, 8:52 pm

Old PC not fixed still and most of my MSTS stuff is on there. Getting used to route work on a laptop though.


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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  35005CP on Sat 10 May 2014, 9:09 pm

NiallGray wrote:Old PC not fixed still and most of my MSTS stuff is on there. Getting used to route work on a laptop though.


It's really great work Niall! You would be surprised what can be done on a laptop! I do all mine on a laptop.  Very Happy 

Cheers

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Sun 11 May 2014, 8:45 am

Thanks Andy. I'm really pleased with how Johnstone and the container depot at Elderslie mirror real-life.

I prefer the PC if I am honest, no need for a numpad and MSTS always looked better on it because of the graphics card. I really need to see if it can be fixed soon.


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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Fri 16 May 2014, 2:53 pm

Station number 20 has been added, another most of you will have never heard of! Laughing

Went to add some track after Johnstone so AI trains could disappear out of sight and ended up going as far as Milliken Park, the next station along. That's about as far as it will go because it's not far from the end of the current tiles. It's a very simplistic station in real life so I should be able to replicate it.

No pictures yet because there's only track there at present.

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Sun 18 May 2014, 9:54 pm

#20 Milliken Park



Not too much work done, weather's too good at the moment! Once I've scenerised around the station, I'll begin working back to Johnstone.

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Fri 23 May 2014, 10:12 pm

A few marathon sessions yesterday and today, and the extension from Paisley GS to Milliken Park via Elderslie and Johnstone is now complete. Having never originally planned to do anything of the Ayr line, I'm really pleased with how it's turned out.



I'll be sending out a belated update to testers at the end of the weekend.

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  rufuskins on Sat 24 May 2014, 7:53 am

I've run out of superlatives. So I'll keep it simple.

Nice work Niall.


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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Sat 24 May 2014, 5:32 pm

I'll keep my response short. "Thanks!"

With my little Ayr line extension complete, attention now turns to a bit of housekeeping from previous testing feedback.



Testers found that 6-car trains would disappear as they left Partick station as there was not enough track past the end of the westbound platform, so I've added a few hundred metres. I didn't go as far as Hyndland (I've stated before the Hyndland layout has defeated me too many times), but I laid enough track for trains to disappear out of sight. Next job will be to scenerise the short stretch.

I won't be do any pics of the short extension as frankly, not much to see! Laughing

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Fri 06 Jun 2014, 9:38 pm

Bit of a hiatus at the moment.

While I wait to get the go-ahead to work on the Glasgow Central area, with no more stations to add, we're in full testing mode.

Hopefully the guys will be able to find any faults now, so that'll it save time when the route is complete.

Got to say that after adding a few snow textures to the route, it's amazing the difference they can make.

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Tue 24 Jun 2014, 8:31 pm

The short extension at Partick (so trains can disappear out of sight) is complete.

Now getting ready to work on the final tiles I want to do for V4; around Glasgow Central.

For me, Glasgow Central is the focal point of the route and needs an overhaul. However, even stripped down there's still over 1000 objects on the tile (mostly track, signals, catenary masts, etc.), so I can't go overboard with scenery. The City Union line is also on the tile, but as there's so little scope for acts, I have made the decision that scenery on it will be minimal.

A lot of work is needed here to improve these tiles but I am looking forward to the challenge.

If there's anyone who is able to make a group of low poly buildings (ie numerous objects, but only one shape file) or even a city backdrop or two, please get in touch, as I would love your help!

Niall

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Sun 29 Jun 2014, 9:26 pm

If you've followed the route progress, the Glasgow Central tile was the last bit of the route to do for V4 (bar any issues found in testing).

For now, what I have been doing is stripping back the tile as there's so much on it and I need to try and improve the scenery without placing too many items.

First job, is to sort out the City Union line, which is on the same tile. As stated before I'm keeping the scenery light but as most of this line is on viaducts, I'm trying to place them wherever possible.

As you see in the below pics, it's very early days.


The 27 has just crossed the WCML and is now heading north towards the river Clyde.


Took ages to find a bridge to fit the river, but the Kew Bridge from UKTS library was my favourite out of all the bridges I downloaded (and I downloaded a lot!)

That's all for now, and before anyone asks, yes, Glasgow Central station is getting a makeover, courtesy of the brilliant sundaypm. It will be worth waiting for! Very Happy

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  rufuskins on Mon 30 Jun 2014, 7:37 am

I can see that we won't be disappointed with the final result. Thanks for the update and screenshots.


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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Mon 30 Jun 2014, 9:01 am

Thanks Alec. I'm taking this tile very slowly, a lot of trial and error at the moment as I find out what works and what doesn't.

I've constantly got one eye on the tile count when in route editor. Making it look nice is one thing but not to put too much on it that you can't put more than a couple of trains in Central without it falling over.

I noticed on screenshots of Central in one TS2013 route, there's barely any scenery at Central. I don't want that to be the case for mine.

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Thu 03 Jul 2014, 10:43 am

Bar that gap you see in the first pic of the last update, the viaducts now stretch along the City Union line and finish not far from the junction near Bellgrove.

With the route safely backed up, I'm now trying to see if I can improve the Eglinton Street area. For those who don't know it, it's where the tunnels begin on the main line south of Glasgow Central. (Many years ago there was a station there... before my time!)

What I'm trying to do is cut back the tunnel length a little and also insert a short open section on the lines used by the Whifflet trains.

So far the results have not been good. Had a few problems develop, causing me to go back to the working copy and start again. Other problems include finding scenery items that fit.

I'll give it a few more evenings of work but if I have no joy, I'm afraid the area will have to stay as it is and I'll just tidy up as best I can.

To most of you, this will mean nothing, but to me it's an area I really want to improve.

Niall

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  casperdog on Thu 03 Jul 2014, 1:32 pm

Hi Niall,
Not sure what type of scenery items you're looking for, but there's some  'apartment' buildings in the library (by Ian Jenkins i think) that are quite big and fill the 'close to lineside' spaces quite nicely. Some are modern, some 50'ish.

Also I found some big apartment blocks from a German site that can be used in the distance. A couple of them are enormous in the area they cover. I can send you the files or some grabs to see if you like them.

Both have no restriction on use as long as it's a freeware route

Cheers
Clive


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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Thu 03 Jul 2014, 2:55 pm

Hi Clive, I'm after groups of buildings, ie four or five warehouses, but only the one shape file. I need to keep the tile count down and trying to fill the tile with as few, low poly items as possible. There are a few older groups of buildings but they look dated and I'm not sure I'd get permission to tinker with re-skinning them.

I already use Ian's buildings as they are very good. I think I may have seen the German ones as I've been scouring other traim sim sites.

I'm after something that will be close to the line. I'm not doing much in the way of distance scenery, again because of the tile count.

Regards,

Niall

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  casperdog on Thu 03 Jul 2014, 3:17 pm

Hi Niall,
How about these?

I actually cloned them from 1 of Don Hintons routes(with his permission) but they're from an uploader to trainsimdotcom whose name I forget.



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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Thu 03 Jul 2014, 10:15 pm

Hi Clive,

Those were by Teemu and I have some in my route. I was unable to get in touch with him to alter the textures as they don't sit well in a modern era route.

But that is the sort of thing I was on about, a clump of buildings and the one shape file.

Niall

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Fri 04 Jul 2014, 10:34 am

Last night's "progress" at Eglinton Street.



The area I've highlighted in red is where the tunnels used to run to. Where I have them now starting is more realistic. The lines at the top are for the Cathcart Circle. In real life they are closer to the main line and the gradient is steeper.

I've altered what I can and made the gradient a little steeper, but it is the best I can do. However, any trains running along it will be slightly higher, so a positive result.

Because of dynamic track pieces (grrrr!) I've had a number of issues, but this time the track changes have actually taken, so I've backed up and will attack again over the weekend. Next job is to remove another section of tunnel to put a small open section in.

If that works and I can put walls in that don't show through the next tunnel's walls then I know that this idea is going to work and I can get on with scenerising it.

Fingers well and truly crossed (though not while in RE as it would be difficult to use the mouse and keyboard! Wink )

Niall

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  neanderthal on Fri 04 Jul 2014, 11:01 am

Hello Niall,I'm pretty sure that every bodies got their Fingers,Legs and even Toe's crossed in anticipation of this Route.It just seems to go onward and upward every time I get a glimpse of it.Thanks in advance. Very Happy 


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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Fri 04 Jul 2014, 11:10 am

Thanks Roger, much appreciated.

I always knew that Glasgow Central would be the hardest part to do, hence it was left to last. It was the only part of V3 I was really unhappy with, but now it's getting the makeover it deserves.

The good thing is that for the last year, I've been getting people to test at every stage, so once this area is finally complete, it should not take too long in testing before we're ready to go.

Niall

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Sun 06 Jul 2014, 12:26 am



Who would have thought a small open section in the tunnels could take all afternoon and evening. Well, this one did!

Twice I put in walls here only to find in testing that they disappeared when you drove close to them. Third time lucky.

Next problem, how can you bury the tunnels next to this open stretch? Answer, you can't. Grrrr...

After hours of trying to cover or part-cover the tunnels, I had to give up. Currently now placing shapes over the tops of the tunnels to see if that works.

The things we do just to make something look a little more realistic!  BashHead 

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Sun 06 Jul 2014, 10:49 am

As Alec (rufuskins) said on his thread, train simulation is all about compromise and I'm experiencing that especially in my quest to re-work the Eglinton Street area.



Compromises being no fancy tunnel entrance on the WCML tracks (nothing similar exists in MSTS), the colour of the walls (real life they are a sandstone red but the only similar walls have habit of disappearing when trains are close) and in this version the road will not be going over the Whifflet line tunnel entrance (just causes too many problems).

And despite all that, I'm much happier with how this looks now. It's cleaner, tidier, and once I get to add a few buildings up top and some vegetation between the tracks, it will fit in much better with the overall look of the route.

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  rufuskins on Sun 06 Jul 2014, 11:52 am

Well it certainly looks good to me.


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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  casperdog on Sun 06 Jul 2014, 4:54 pm

NiallGray wrote:As Alec (rufuskins) said on his thread, train simulation is all about compromise and I'm experiencing that especially in my quest to re-work the Eglinton Street area.



real life they are a sandstone red but the only similar walls have habit of disappearing when trains are close

Hi Niall,
Have you tried uncompressing the shapes, and altering the vol sphere figure.

An example from the model of Stanford station building which was doing the same

shape (
shape_header ( 00000000 00000000 )
volumes ( 1
vol_sphere (
vector ( -5.47221 7 -6.90959 )93.5462
)
)

Changed to.........vector ( -5.47221 7 -6.90959 )293.5462

and problem solved. I often modify this figure to solve the disappearing shape.

Cheers
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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Sun 06 Jul 2014, 5:05 pm

I didn't know that, Clive. I'm going to leave them in now as it takes so long to do anything on that tile.

However, I have an item that I built myself in Sketchup that I use on another part of the route and the same problem occurs.

Can you explain the significance of adding the two, please? I'm interested to know why that works.

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  casperdog on Sun 06 Jul 2014, 5:56 pm

Hi Niall,
It doesn't have to be 2. You just need to increase the original figure by an amount to stop the shape disappearing. so it could be 21.12>51.12, 145.36>345.36 etc,etc.

I just tend to put a 1 or 2 in front as it usually works first time.

There was an explanation of why it happens and the trick of modifying the shape file on either UKTS or Trainsim.com but I can't find it.

Not sure of the exact reason, but it is something about how MSTS 'sees' a shape. It quite often happens on things such as walls or platforms where the shape is centred at one end. In my case, Stanford station is on a road overbridge that spans several tracks to the left and right of the station building but the model isn't centred on the station building in TSM. The vol sphere figures seem to control the viewing circle around the origin of a shape. By enlarging that circle, the shape stops disappearing.

Cheers
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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Sun 06 Jul 2014, 6:18 pm

Thanks for that, much appreciated. Hopefully, it'll work for me as well.

Niall

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  35005CP on Sun 06 Jul 2014, 8:03 pm

Can I just say that Tunnel entrance and the surroundings look superb! Great job mate!  Very Happy 
I really envy you Route Builders and the fantastic work you put in! Hopefully I can get to this standard someday! I fear this will be sometime though learning the tricks of the trade!
Cheers
Andy


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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Sun 06 Jul 2014, 8:20 pm

35005CP wrote:Can I just say that Tunnel entrance and the surroundings look superb! Great job mate!  Very Happy 
I really envy you Route Builders and the fantastic work you put in! Hopefully I can get to this standard someday! I fear this will be sometime though learning the tricks of the trade!
Cheers
Andy

Selective camera angles, my friend. The tunnels, I like; the road out of shot on the left of the wall, I do not!

Driving me mad. Have to get the road from above the tunnels down to under the city union line. The gradients are just unrealistic.

I fear another compromise coming!  Sad 

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Mon 07 Jul 2014, 9:43 am

Progress still painfully slow, but it's amazing how even half a dozen pieces of scenery can transform a scene.

BEFORE


AFTER

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  rufuskins on Mon 07 Jul 2014, 11:30 am

You're not wrong that's for sure. I also echo Andy's comments.


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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  andrew moody on Mon 07 Jul 2014, 11:56 am

Hi Niall.
Your tunnel is Looking absolutly great and I very much like your choice of train as well!
I am still catching up on whats been happening over the last three or so weeks. I saw your posting on UKTS about some green 4 wheeled
45 ton oil tanks,presumably for an activity.
I spent a couple of days around the longest day covering part of your route between Abingdon and Lockerbie on the WCML.
Plenty of Virgin Pendolinos and a few class 221s and now also First Trans Penine class 350 Desiros and the odd class 185 Diesel version.
There is still a bit of freight activity, a few Freightliner Heavy haul class 66 on bogie coal hoppers, there is a daily Dalston to Grangemouth
oil train formed of 100 ton bogie tanks, a daily 1400 Coatbridge Crewe freightliner worked by a pair of class 86s a few DRS class 66 hauled
Intermodals on the Coatbridge Daventry circut. Also a few EWS or is it DBS? class 92s. and of course the Sheildmuir-Warrington Royal Mail
trains formed of class 325s.
With the exception of the FTP class 350s all of these are available in the UKTS file liberary.
One passenger train that should be considered for an activity is the 2355 London Euston to Glasgow/Edinburgh sleeper which this time of the year departs Carlisle at 0500 in daylight passing Crawford one hour later, the train divides at Carstairs.
I am not sure how much far down the road you are before considering some activities but hope the above is of help.
Cheers
Andy


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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Mon 07 Jul 2014, 12:19 pm

Hi Andy.

I have a couple of people on the testing team who want to write acts for V4, but I have no idea what they are planning in terms of activities.

Now that more of the main line between Carlisle and Carstairs has been uprgraded, I'm hoping that after release it will encourage folk to have a go at acts that cover the main line.

I'm not very good at freight acts, so I tend to avoid them.

My time will be spent updating all the V2/V3 acts I wrote and then doing some introductory acts for the new sections.

Scottm did some great Sleeper acts for V2, but they won't work on V4. Last time I spoke with him, his PC had failed, so I've no idea if he'll ever re-visit and re-upload them.

Niall

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Mon 07 Jul 2014, 5:29 pm

The southern end of the tunnels has had a makeover as well. It's even more difficult to adjust things at this end because it's on a tile which was re-vamped for V3, so there's already a very high tile count. However, pleased with what I was able to achieve.



The aerial view of this area is not as good as I hoped but I'm very happy with how it looks lineside, on passenger views and from inside the cab.



Next job will be to finally sort a parallel road issue at the other end of the tunnels so I can start working back towards Central.

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  35005CP on Mon 07 Jul 2014, 6:02 pm

Wow Looks fantastic Niall!  Shocked Very Happy 
Can I ask if the screenshots are MSTS or OR?
Cheers
Andy

(P.S - I haven't had a PM yet)


Andy - TSSH Footplate Crew
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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Mon 07 Jul 2014, 7:20 pm

MSTS.

This is OR, mate....  Very Happy 






(My PM box was full, hopefully sent to you soon. If not will have to find link and send again)

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  casperdog on Tue 08 Jul 2014, 9:16 pm

Hi Niall,
Those tunnel entrances and cutting walls do look very impressive.

Cheers
clive


Thames Trent V3 :30 miles to go.
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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Tue 08 Jul 2014, 11:30 pm

Thanks Clive.

The tunnels entrances are the excellent work of Cobos from his Scottish Central route. All I did was re-size them to fit standard track and overhead wires.

The cutting walls are courtesy of sundaypm. If you want them for your route, I'd be happy to ask Derek for you.

Niall

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  NiallGray on Wed 09 Jul 2014, 11:10 am

Lengthy, but hopefully informative update for those who have followed progress.

Having finally re-worked the tunnels, I've spent the last two evenings in RE working on the Glasgow Central area (well, except when footy was on!). Trying to place scenery on a tile that already had over 1000 objects has proved very difficult.

First attempts to place lots of scenery and make the scenery very dense went exactly as I expected; the route suffered unless it was on the lowest of settings (and I mean lowest). And that was just in explore! So I went to the previous backup and started again.

So there's less scenery now, but despite this, I still think I've been able to carry off a city feel. I placed scenery according to the window rule; i.e. how does it look out of the cab and passenger windows? As you cross the river, you'll be able to see the City Union line off to your left and to the right, you'll just be able to make out the traffic crossing the Kingston Bridge in the distance.

It's obvious, but I'll say it anyway, the improvements to Glasgow Central will affect frame rates, some users will probably need to turn down their settings.

There's still a fair bit of work to be done and I'm waiting for some help with the track between the tunnels you saw earlier in the pics and where the lines split for Gourock. In the meantime there's loads of little jobs I can get on with. Despite the advanced state of the route, a release date is still quite a way off as there's lots of testing to come.

Depending on how the testers get on, I may need to curtail scenery a bit more, so am currently in the process of looking at MSTS sites for buildings which take up space, have a modern feel and don't kill the frame rates (or tile count).

There's no point posting any more pics until the tile is complete and you can see Glasgow Central in all its glory (and it's worth waiting for!). It could be a while as I'm away from home a fair bit over the summer.

But I'll sign off for now with one teaser shot for you, looking from Central Bridge towards the Kingston road bridge (re-sized northbridge from Scottish Central).

Remember, it's WIP so the final version could be completely different.



Hope you like it! Smile

Niall

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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

Post  neanderthal on Wed 09 Jul 2014, 11:21 am

We like it Niall,and I'm sure we can wait until your sure its how you want it. Very Happy 


Roger
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Re: Glasgow-Carlisle V4

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